If a person came home and discovered that a close relative had died, if he found the mourners on the second or third day of mourning, he completes the 7 days with them (thereby only mourning for 5 days). If he came on the fourth day, he must mourn a full week.

R. Shimon: Even if he comes on the fourth day, he must merely complete the 7 days of mourning with them.

R. Yehoshua ben Levi: The Halachah follows R. Shimon if he is not the most senior member of the household. If he is, he must count for himself.

It is like the case of R. Mana who instructed R. Armanaya - since you are the most senior member of the household, you must count for yourself. This is true when most of the visitors have not yet come, but if they have already come before the other mourners finish mourning, the other mourners may take him to the bathhouse when the visitors leave.

It is like the case of Rav Huna who instructed R. Yehudah bar Zavdi's brother - since most visitors have already come, they may take him to the bathhouse.

If they are transferring the body from place to place, like those who bury in Beis Shearim -

Beraisa #1: These mourners count from when the body leaves their place and these mourners count from when the grave is closed.

Beraisa #2: Both count from when the grave is closed.

R. Simon quoting R. Yehoshua B''L: All follow the most senior family member.

R. Yaakov bar Acha quoting R. Asi: That is a stringent view. What is its stringency? If the senior family member is here, those that are here count from when the body is removed and those that are there (where the body is being taken to) count from when the grave is closed up. If the senior family member is there, all count from when the grave is closed up.

It is like Gamliel Zuga whose sister died and his brother Hillel accompanied the body to be taken for burial.

R. Mana to Gamliel: Since your oldest brother (Hillel) remains at home, when you return home you should start to count, rather than from when the grave is closed. (Note: This explanation follows the text of Tosefos.)

If they were moving a body from grave to grave -

Beraisa #1: They begin mourning (only) when the first grave is closed up.

Beraisa #2: They begin mourning when the second grave is closed up.

Such a case happened to R. Yonah; he asked R. Chananya, friend of the Rabbanan what must be done.

R. Chananya to R. Yonah: Begin mourning from when the first grave is closed up.

Such a case happened to R. Yirmiyah; he asked R. Zeirah who asked R. Imi.

They told R. Yirmiyah: Begin mourning from when the second grave is closed up.

R. Yirmiyah came to R. Chananya. R. Chananya told him - they have been strict with you.

R. Yona and R. Yosa: We only count from when the second grave is closed up if the body was moved during the 7 days of mourning. However, if it was moved after those days, the mourning period has already passed and there is no additional mourning. This applies when he planned to move the body; otherwise, he begins the mourning from the closing of the first grave.

It is like the case of old Gamliel - the people of Kursai buried him in the place of R. Simon. After 3 days, they decided to reinter him in his own place.

They came to ask R. Simon - He quoted R. Yehoshua ben Levi as ruling that since you did not plan on reinterring him, the mourning is counted from when the first grave was closed up.

A case like this happened to Yeshua, the brother of Duray. They asked R. Abahu and he answered that they should count from the closing of the second grave.

R. Yaakov bar Acha to R. Abahu: You were with me when we asked R. Avudama of Haifa this question and he answered that one should count from when the first grave was closed up.

R. Abahu replies: I did not hear that, but if you did, go out and rule this way.

Question: Where is there a source in the Torah for the 7 days of mourning? (Although this period is Rabbinically required, the Sages would not have decreed it if there was no mention of it in the Torah.) The Pasuk states (Bereishis 50, 10) "He (Yosef) made mourning for his father (Yaakov) for seven days.''

Rejection: Can we learn from the way they acted before the Torah was given?

Source #2 (R. Yaakov bar Acha quoting R. Zeirah): We can learn it from the Pasuk that states about the inauguration of the Mishkan (Vayikra 8, 35), "You shall dwell at the entrance to the tent of meeting day and night for 7 days, and you shall guard the guarding of Hashem''. Just as the Holy One waited for his world for 7 days (by, so to speak, mourning His world before He destroyed it in the Great Flood), so you should wait your brother for 7 days.

Question: What is the source to say that Hash-m waited for his world for 7 days? The Pasuk states (Bereishis 7, 10), "And it was after 7 days, the waters of the flood were upon the earth.

Question: Do we mourn before a person dies?

Answer: A human who does not know the future can only mourn after death; Hash-m knows the future so He can mourn even before it.

Answer #2: These were the days of mourning for the Righteous Mesushelach.

Source #3 (R. Hoshiyah): The Pasuk states (Vayikra 10, 7), "...for the anointing oil of Hash-m is upon you''. Just as you were anointed for 7 days (at the inauguration of the Mishkan), so you should wait for your friend for 7 days.

R. Abahu quoting R. Yochanan: (Bamidbar 12, 12), "She (Miryam, who contracted Tzoraas after speaking derogatorily about her brother Moshe) should not be like the dead...close her away...'' - just as one is quarantined for 7 days, so the period of (impurity for) the dead is 7 days.

One Rabbi told this statement of R. Yochanan to R. Shimon ben Lakish and he did not accept it. R''SBL said, "Here he said that Miryam's Tumah was only of the level of Hesger (being quarantined because of a doubtful status of Tzaraas) and here he said that her Tumah was on the level of Hechlet (being quarantined because of certain Tzaraas)''...

As R. Yochanan quoted from R. Yanai as follows - the Pasuk states (ibid), "she should not be like the dead'' - just as the days of Tumah from a corpse do not count for the required days of a Nazir, so the days of Hechlet (quarantine) do not count.

R. Yirmiyah/ R. Chiya quoting R''SBL/ R. Abahu/ R. Yosa ben Chanina quoting R''SBL: The Pasuk states (Devarim 34, 8), "And the days of crying for the mourning of Moshe ended'' - 'the days' are 7; 'crying' - are 2; 'mourning' - are 30 days. Some say that 'days' are 2; 'crying' - are 7; 'mourning' are 30 days.

R. Yosa/ R. Chiya quoting R''SBL/ R. Yona/ R. Chiya and R''SBL quoting R. Yudan Nesiya: The Pasuk states (Amos 8, 10), "I shall overturn your festival to mourning''. Just as the festival lasts for 7 days, so the days of mourning last 7 days.

Question (R. Ami to R. Chiya bar Ba): If so, just as the festival lasts for 8 days (including Shemini Atzeres), so the days of mourning should last 8 days?

Answer (R. Chiya bar Ba): Shemini [Atzeres] is its own separate festival.

Question (R. Ami): If Shavuos lasts for only one day, so the period of mourning should be for only one day?

Answer (R''CBB): This is actually the source for (observing one day for) a "Shemuah Rechokah'' - "a distant report''. There is also a Beraisah that teaches this - For a "Shemuah Kerovah'' - "a current report'', the mourner observes the 7 and 30 day periods; for a Shemuah Kerovah, he does not observe them.

Beraisa #1: It is considered a Shemuah Kerovah if he heard within 30 days of death; after more than 30 days, it is considered a Shemuah Rechokah.

Beraisa #2: A Shemuah Kerovah is within 12 months; after 12 months is a Shemuah Rechokah.

R. Abahu quoting R. Yochanan: According to Beraisa #1, if during a festival, a person heard that his close relative died, but by the end of the festival, the 30 days had passed (and it became like a Shemuah Rechokah) -

Answer (Chevraya): Since he heard it during the 30 days, he should observe 7 days after the 30 days.

R. Yosa to Chevraya: Since he heard at a time when he cannot mourn, it is as if he heard it after the 30 days and he must only observe one day after the 30 days.

R. Idi of Kisarin quoting R. Yochanan: If a Shemuah Kerovah came on Shabbos, on Sunday he should tear his garment and mourn.

R. Chananyah: He does not mourn.

Question (R. Mana to R. Chananyah): Can there be tearing without mourning?

Answer (R. Chananyah to R. Mana): Yes, as we find that for a parent, even later, when there is no mourning, one would still need to tear.

R. Abahu quoting R. Yochanan: Even the relatives of relatives may not take a haircut.

It is like the case of R. Mana who was in Kisarin and he heard that his grandson had died. He (nevertheless) went and took a haircut.

Question (They said to him): Did you not teach us that even for a grandson, one may not take a haircut?

Answer (R. Mana): This applies to those who are with the mourner, but I am not with him.

R. Avudimi bar Tuvi quoting R. Abahu: Even a grandson must tear his garment, as R. Abahu taught - the Pasuk states (Yechezkel 24, 17), "Be silent from groaning'' - this teaches that he must cry out. "...the mourning of the dead you shall not make'' - this teaches that for one's close relatives, one must mourn.