(Mishnah): One who kidnaps a Yisrael is not liable until he takes him into his premises.

R. Yehudah says, he is not liable until he takes him into his premises and makes him work - "v'His'amer Bo u'Mecharo."

R. Yochanan ben Brokah says, if one kidnaps his son he is liable. Chachamim exempt.

R. Yehudah says, if one kidnaps a half-slave, half free man, he is liable. Chachamim exempt.

(Gemara): Which Lav forbids the first theft [of a Ben Sorer u'Moreh]? "Lo Signov." (This is in Aseres ha'Dibros. It forbids also kidnapping.) Which Lav forbids his second theft? "Lo Signovu" (in Parshas Kedoshim, which forbids stealing money).

"Lo Signovu" in order to vex (even if he intends to return it). Lo Signovu in order to pay Kefel, or to pay four or five (to one who would not accept a gift).

Ben Bag Bag says, "Lo Signov" yours from the thief, lest you look like a thief.

(R. Ba citing R. Yochanan citing R. Hoshayah): [Ben Sorer u'Moreh] is liable only if he stole coins.

(R. Zeirah citing R. Hoshayah): He is liable only if he cheapens coins.

Question: What does it mean "he cheapens coins"? What is the case?

If he says "here are five [Dinarim]. Give to me three [Dinarim worth of meat]", he is a fool!

If he says "here are three. Give to me [meat worth] five", this is a normal person [who seeks to get a bargain]!

Answer: Rather, we discuss one who says "here are five. Give to me [meat worth] five" [at a time when meat is cheap, and he did not need so much].

Question: What is a Ganav, and what is a Gazlan?

Answer #1 (R. Heila): One who steals in front of witnesses is a Ganav. One who steals in front of the owner is a Gazlan.

Rebuttal (R. Zeirah): Even if he intended to steal the item and the owner, this is not a Gazlan! (A kidnapper is called a Ganav - "Gonev Ish.")

Question: If so, according to R. Zeirah, what is a Gazlan?

Answer #2 (R. Shmuel bar Susarta citing R. Avahu): He must steal in front of 10 people.

The Binyan Av for all of them [to teach that Gezel is taking openly by force] is "va'Yigzol Es ha'Chanis mi'Yad ha'Mitzri..."

What is the reason of R. Yochanan ben Brokah [who obligates for kidnapping his own son]? It says [anyone] "mi'Bnei Yisrael." What is the reason of Chachamim [who exempt]? "Me'Echav", and not from his sons.

What is the reason of R. Yehudah [who obligates one who kidnaps a half-slave]? "Me'Echav", and even one who is half from his brothers (free). What is the reason of Rabanan? "Me'Echav" - he must be totally his brother (free).